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Post by jbrams on Mar 6, 2019 10:01:09 GMT
I was just wondering if it would be possible to split the Iron Islands into multiple counties not multiple baronies - this would be particularly worthwhile as so many noble houses are unplayable with just baronies, plus I think it would make the dynamics of the Iron Islands a lot more interesting, currently barons don't really pose any real threat to counts and barons, but if the islands were composed of lots of single holding counties you would have a lot of squabbling and also a lot more candidates in a Kingsmoot which would better reflect the political status of the Iron Islands, currently you're probably not going to see a baron become King, this would fix that, also it would mean that the various cadet branches of the Harlaws and Goodbrothers would be able to squabble with each other over who gets the duchy just as is happening in the lore. I guess the limiting factor could be the physical size of counties on the map?
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Post by caeserion on Mar 6, 2019 18:08:23 GMT
I like this but it would Ironborn more OP than other kingdoms I think. A balance option could be reducing the number of troops Ironbonn castles get so that all though there are more counts, they each command fewer troops.
I imagine reworking the map would be pretty complicated and time-consuming though and for not that much benefit.
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Toccs
Moderator
Posts: 474 
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Post by Toccs on Mar 6, 2019 23:19:28 GMT
This is certainly something that's worth considering the next time we do map/province redrawing.
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Post by soulbourne on Mar 7, 2019 3:38:13 GMT
I can see the lack of extra holdings being a problem for expanding your internal realm and trying to play tall-however, given the fact true ironborn dont sow or work the land, and sustain themsevles either through thrall labor or through raiding, I imagine that this would represent the relatively low potential development of the region well to have mostly only top holdings available and no baronies. As long as the existing castles are simply moved to be 1 slot counties(So no sub holding slots) it shouldn't upset the balance much at all unless you just add in more castles than already exist.
I do however feel that if this is done, there is something to be said about ironborn having a rare event when they have slave camps to potentially upgrade the size of their holding as the thralls of several generations integrate into the ironborn region and expand how many people it can readily support. This would negate any potential income loss from lack of city baronies used to upgrade otherwise and reflect the fact that thralls are owned in battle and not through gold, so would likely over time trickle out of servitude as their masters saw fit and integrate into the lowborns of the isles.
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Post by kuczaja on Mar 8, 2019 0:06:13 GMT
I support general idea of adding few provinces to Iron Islands. Namely Iron Holt and second province for Orkmont, maybe more. But no promises.
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Post by jbrams on Mar 15, 2019 11:06:28 GMT
This is certainly something that's worth considering the next time we do map/province redrawing. Is a redrawing a likelihood at any time soon (I know it won't be in the next update) but is there an appetite amongst the devs for it or is it pretty settled and therefore unlikely anything changes for at least several updates I support general idea of adding few provinces to Iron Islands. Namely Iron Holt and second province for Orkmont, maybe more. But no promises. My thoughts on it are as follows: Blacktyde - left as it is Orkmont - House Tawney given a province and potentially the Goodbrother cadet branch given a province Harlaw - House Kenning given a province, House Myre given a province, Grey Garden made into a province, the Tower of Glimmering made into a province (the two lines who seem most prestigious after the main line, and the two lines that are squabbling over inheritance to Ten Towers - could make for an interesting playthrough as the cousins war over the duchy for example) Pyke - House Wynch given a province, also not as a province but House Ironmaker should probably get a barony Saltcliffe - House Sunderly given a province (a Sunderly married Quellon Greyjoy reflecting their prestige) Old Wyk - House Stonehouse given a province Great Wyk - House Sparr given a province, and then one or two Goodbrother cadets given provinces to enable dynastic squabbling - Downdelving and Corpse Lake perhaps? Also Lonely Light is meant to be surrounded by 13 smaller islands - most of them are probably little more than rocks in the sea but it might be worth adding one or two as ruins, to enable colonisation if you have the funds |
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Post by kuczaja on Mar 15, 2019 13:27:02 GMT
Thats definetely too much. Satcliffe cant be divided, its too small. For other isles i dont see that much of benefit for adding new provinces. Yeah, Wynches are plotwise important house and Orkmont is explicitly said to be wealthier isle than Pyke but 6 provinces for Great Wyk would be even more than in CK1 War of the Usurper.
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Post by jbrams on Mar 15, 2019 15:01:09 GMT
Thats definetely too much. Satcliffe cant be divided, its too small. For other isles i dont see that much of benefit for adding new provinces. Yeah, Wynches are plotwise important house and Orkmont is explicitly said to be wealthier isle than Pyke but 6 provinces for Great Wyk would be even more than in CK1 War of the Usurper. Ok fair enough- I was wondering how small provinces could be and if that would be an issue. If so I guess I'd reduce my suggestions to just the following: Orkmont - new province for House Tawney Harlaw - new province for House Myre, House Kenning, and Grey Garden (Harlaw is the richest of the islands - if anywhere would merit 6 provinces it is Harlaw and Harras the Knight's father marrying a Serrett suggests Grey Garden is wealthy also Myres and Kenning fought with the Harlaw for centuries for Harlaw suggesting more power than just a barony) Pyke - new province for House Wynch and new barony for House Ironmaker Great Wyk - new province for House Sparr Old Wyk (not sure if it would be too small to split but would be nice to give House Stonehouse a province) |
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Post by kuczaja on Mar 15, 2019 16:00:27 GMT
I like your Pyke and Orkmont suggestions but i still think that Harlaw shouldn't go beyond 4 provs. I like idea of one for house Myre or Kenning but im not sure about it. And still - no promises. We need to discuss it internally.
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